Re: Pattern free! (or 'Loosening the training wheels!') Posted by pagestep007 on Jul 25, 2012
Lola, is it general practice to have the mouth half open/closed at rest? I do mine basically closed ´because when you've done several hours filming, you get tired and you have the tendency of having a puppet on screen with their mouths open like a zoned out character by default, because of a tired puppeteer, and so with a closed mouth a tired puppeteer in that case  defaults to a mouth closed which takes little energy. You only need to use energy to open when they have to speak ...mind you  later ones I've done that are in foam and silicone I did half open because the foam was really stiff to open... just wondering.
Re: Pattern free! (or 'Loosening the training wheels!') Posted by Shawn on Jul 25, 2012
I've heard and followed the open mouth rule myself and in fact almost started to mention it in this post but then I got to thinking... Why?  I think this is perhaps where it comes from.

1) An open mouth when closed will tend to give you that character smile crease at the corners when you do close it.

2) If you are carving your head out of a solid block of foam then you really do need to carve it in the open position for the reason you mentioned about the resistance and the opening being stiff. In fact if you don't then you risk the corners of the mouth tearing.

3) If you create a mouth in a closed position then when you open it the material in the lower chin has to compress or fold up this could cause a double chin.

I am sure there are other aspects of this if we thought of them.  I think the lesson to learn here is that rules can be broken and sometimes it is good to re-think why you are actually doing something. There are some things that I used to always do that at some point I asked myself why and realized that it may not be needed in every case.

So in the case of this beak I think we should look at if when it is opened up will that lower beak compress or fold and look odd. Not real sure it is an issue.   
Re: Pattern free! (or 'Loosening the training wheels!') Posted by Lola on Jul 25, 2012
As I as typing this, Shawn posted some of the points I was going to cover. D'oh. Here's the condensed version, without repeating him. 

Apart from the construction...

My knowledge is only from what I've read on boards and advice I've gotten from other puppeteers who have done this extensively. I went over the general theory above (i.e. making the mouth close is easier than making it open). It reduces hand strain and general fatigue, as well as fights carpal tunnel. It's easy for me to strain my wrists, so I always wear wrist supports when constructing or performing.

If you take a look at this pic: http://puppetmuse.blogspot.com/2010/04/stuffed-and-unstrung.html it's a photo someone snapped of the stuffed and unstrung puppets on a rack, as an example of the whole "open mouth at rest" thing.  

I know some people will use clips (binder clips, clips to hold down table cloths, etc.) inside of their puppets mouths while they are "at rest" to reduce the long term strain of the jaw pulling down on the foam while on a stand. I'm no expert, so anyone else with more experience, please feel free to chime in.
Re: Pattern free! (or 'Loosening the training wheels!') Posted by Lola on Jul 25, 2012
Also - looking good, Kelso! I started following you on twitter. Loved the comment about the dining room. Just remember that you will learn something from every puppet, and a setback is just an opportunity to get creative with your puppet. (i.e. this needs facial hair!)
Re: Pattern free! (or 'Loosening the training wheels!') Posted by kelso on Jul 26, 2012
^ Thanks, Lola!  I followed you right back!

Posted by: Shawn Sorrell on Jul 25, 2012
Always cut your fabric a bit larger then you need it. You can always trim off the excess once you get it in place.  In the case of a mouth what you can actually do is wrap the skin (yellow fleece in this case) around the edge and onto the mouth plate. When you are rounding a curve like on the tips of your beak you can cut small little triangles in the edge of the fabric. This reduces bulk and lets you get a smooth edge. Now since you have wrapped around the edge onto the mouth plate you need to put your black felt in last. The thing is it is easy since it is a flat surface and you can cut your black felt exactly the shape you need!  

Those are great tips, thanks. I made the mistake of starting with cutting and gluing the black felt for the mouth plate. I left the edges unglued so that I could tuck the yellow fleece underneath it, but it didn't help much because I didn't leave extra material.  I then tried to cut the yellow fleece to size and secure it with hot glue, laying the black felt over it.  So... I cut myself into a corner.  When the one edge didn't quite reach and the tips puckered a bit, I had no room to play with.  The method you suggest sounds like it would have solved that problem nicely.  

I now have my bird's head all pinned and marked and ready to sew, but the thread I bought it a bit too light so I'm going to have to wait until I can go back for a darker shade before proceeding.

Message Image
http://puppetbuilding.blogspot.com/2012/07/duck-head-ready-to-sew.html
Re: Pattern free! (or 'Loosening the training wheels!') Posted by Out of the Box Puppets on Jul 27, 2012
I agree with Lola, every puppet "mistake" is a chance to learn something.  Looking good. 

Julie
Re: Pattern free! (or 'Loosening the training wheels!') Posted by Gail on Jul 27, 2012
Never tried this but could you glue or sew a thin trim to cover the fabric edge like maybe small round black cord. Like an outline on a picture it straightens and sharpens the edge. I would try it on a scrap to see if I liked it before on the puppet.

I like the closed mouth rather than the mouth you have to force shut. My hand hurts more when I never get a rest with the open mouths, but then I have bad arthritis in my hands. My puppeteers like closed mouths more too. It is not so much the amount of force used but the lack of rest that is the problem.
Re: Pattern free! (or 'Loosening the training wheels!') Posted by pagestep007 on Jul 27, 2012
Snail, how many  puppeteers do you have?
Re: Pattern free! (or 'Loosening the training wheels!') Posted by kelso on Jul 28, 2012
Posted by: Snail on Jul 27, 2012
Never tried this but could you glue or sew a thin trim to cover the fabric edge like maybe small round black cord. Like an outline on a picture it straightens and sharpens the edge. I would try it on a scrap to see if I liked it before on the puppet.


That's a good idea!  Or I might be able to do it with a thin strip of craft foam.  I'll play around with that, thanks.
Re: Pattern free! (or 'Loosening the training wheels!') Posted by Shawn on Jul 28, 2012
Posted by: kelso on Jul 28, 2012
That's a good idea!  Or I might be able to do it with a thin strip of craft foam.  I'll play around with that, thanks.
If you do that then you'll need to cut your craft foam in the same arch as your mouth plate because the craft foam in a straight strip would not make the curve.
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